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Warning: in file /includes/functions_reimg.php on line 126: Invalid argument supplied for foreach() WorldWorksGames • View topic - Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Post subject: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-16-2004, 05:14 AM
Sprocket Joined: 10-22-2003, 08:57 AM Posts: 13
My group finally finished the Mountain Door area of WotC's Forge of Fury module last week. I purchased several of Denny's products about the time Gothic Realms came out. I figured laying out the Mountain Door area would be a good trial run getting my feet wet putting these things together.
Obviously this uses the CaveWorks set, though I stole props from several sets to dress things up the way I wanted.
You'll probably notice pretty quickly that I kept pretty close to the map. I realized as I got more familiar with the various pieces that it might have been quite a bit easier to essentially redo the entire map to make it more "Masterboard-friendly". The shots of Denny's layouts where every little space on the Masterboard is filled with something are awesome, but once I started following WotC's map I just stuck with it. Too stubborn (or stupid ) I guess. I'm not sure how many others feel the same way, but I think there's really something cool about having the entire level laid out all at once. While I could have broken the thing up into several sections, each of which would fit on the Masterboard, I really wanted to have the thing covering the whole table.
I do want to say it was wonderful to lay new pieces down only as the group approached/entered each area, which I and they both enjoyed. Most went down extremely quickly, within just a few seconds, while some (most notably Room #8, the big room with the well) took a couple minutes to bobby pin everything together.
Anyway, since I don't have a website I had to try and host the pictures on Ofoto.com (hope this works for everyone). Here's the to the album.
The pictures are:
1) The entire Layout from the East side 2) Room #3 - The Rift Hall 3) Room #3 - Bird's Eye view 4) Room #14 - Bunkroom 5) East End of the map - You can see the raised area in the upper right corner where the Ogre lives (Room #12) 6) Room #8 - Large Cavern with well & Room #11 - Orc Quarters 7) Room #9 - Shaman's Lair & Room #10 - Grand Staircase Hall, along with a different view of part of Room #8
I ended up using a DTP program to modify several things (not the least of which was adding Clip-It tabs to all the free walls for easier construction), and came up with a handful of "new" pieces to make this work the way I wanted it. I'll try and take some individual pictures of those and add them to the album in the near future, along with a list of the supplies I'm using on the off chance anyone is actually interested. ;D
Seriously, I've learned a lot from reading about other people's tips & tricks on this website. I just wanted to share a few of my own thoughts in the hopes that someone else can benefit.
Finally, thanks for some wonderful products, Denny! My players and I enjoyed this one immensely and plan on continuing their adventures with WorldWorks!
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-16-2004, 08:51 AM
Gear Head Joined: 05-22-2003, 08:38 AM Posts: 757 Location: Delray Beach, FL
Nice set-up!
Ofoto worked fine for me; one hint to anyone else checking this out, you don't have to sign up to view the album, although it does at first appear like you do - just click on 'view album' (IIRC) under the photo, close down the pop-ups that appear and go through the slideshow.
Digital cameras are wonderful things, aren't they?
"Conan, what is good in GMing?"
"To crush the PCs, see their character sheets stacked before you, and hear the lamentations of their players."
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-16-2004, 11:25 AM
WorldWorks Developer Joined: 05-27-2002, 05:55 AM Posts: 10213 Location: Vancouver Island, Canada
WOW :o Now thats a CaveWorks setup! Thank you for showing everyone what can be accomplished with CaveWorks given some time. Really amazing stuff. Thank you!
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-17-2004, 04:09 AM
Sprocket Joined: 02-15-2004, 08:12 AM Posts: 7
That really looks great!
So you just clipped the floating walls onto masterboard pieces as the party explored along? I was wondering how that would work as I was assembling my moathouse model. It seemed to me that clipping things "as you go" would be too time consuming, and it would be easier just to drop completed rooms onto the board. However, making completed rooms takes a lot longer than just folding the floating walls, and there is less modularity at the end. I'm curious how it worked for you.
Jeff
"Using my steel-strong hair as a MOP, I can scrub up every last bit of this sticky syrup!" --Superman
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-17-2004, 07:43 AM
Boiler Joined: 01-26-2003, 08:44 AM Posts: 228 Location: San Jose, California, USA
That's actually what I've done before. I clip together a basic room beforehand, then attach it to the board afterward. I've found that works pretty well.
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-17-2004, 09:40 AM
Gear Head Joined: 05-22-2003, 08:38 AM Posts: 757 Location: Delray Beach, FL
That's also what I plan on doing with most things WW; because I can only print the stuff on heavy paper (stupid colour laser at work jams if I try to use card, although I'm not complaining really!) I have to pretty much glue everything into place to add some stability (unless I expect to have to worry about minis being placed ON the structure, in which case I stick the paper copy to card and then assemble it.
"Conan, what is good in GMing?"
"To crush the PCs, see their character sheets stacked before you, and hear the lamentations of their players."
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-18-2004, 04:35 AM
Sprocket Joined: 10-22-2003, 08:57 AM Posts: 13
Thanks for the kind words Denny & all! It was a lot of fun to put together and to play with! ;D
cavesalamander, The 4-square and 7-square tunnels that come with CaveWorks inspired me to create a couple version of 2-square tunnels. One with flat-topped walls so I could place the Doors over them, another with the rolling/wavy topped walls that were actually dead-ends rather than tunnels (3 walls with a cave doorway in the 4th). After doing that I really started to take Denny's stuff and make all sorts of "extra" pieces that really fleshed things out for this model. I ended up making tabbed Floating Walls of varying lengths (1 to 7 squares), tabbed Chamber Walls & Doors, two different kinds of stair hallways to lead up to the raised sections, Portcullis doorways, 2x2 tabbed Corridor Corners, etc.
While I tried initially to clip everything together as I laid out the board, it didn't "stay" where I wanted it. I'm very particular (translation: Type A, anal-retentive, etc.) and when the walls didn't stay along the gridlines of the Masterboard sheets because of the varying tension at the corners, well, I just printed floors of the correct size for each room and then used that 3M Post-It tape (comes in blue boxes or packaging) to tape the floor to the pre-clipped walls making individual rooms.
The Post-It tape is great because it sticks very well but doesn't rip, mar, tear or deface the cardstock models when you remove it. I left some on parts of these models for over a month and haven't had any problems removing it (though admittedly I'm not completely done dissembling everything yet, but I don't expect problems as long as I'm careful). Furthermore, since it comes off, you're not stuck with any permanent rooms. Each wall can be reused to make whatever room you want, though you do end up printing & cutting the Floors for each room. The tunnels you'll always end up using in some capacity.
Then, as Luthyr describes, I was able to bring out each room pretty much on its own when the party got to it and attach it with usually no more than 2 bobby pins. Everything, that is, except that big, unwieldly Room #8 with the well. That I ended up taking a few minutes to connect all its various pieces when they got to it, and I'm not thrilled with just slapping down a big mat of MasterBoard floors underneath it, but it is such an odd shaped room that making a special/complete room of that odd shape & size just didn't seem worth it. Still, it ended up not being that big a deal as I was able to describe things as I laid them out and it gave them a chance to take in everything about such a large room over a minute or two. Only after I was completely done with the Assembly, Props and description did I go on to describe the grunts of more orcs down several of the passageways, and we picked up on the story again.
I've been busy the last few nights, so I haven't had a chance to take some pictures of the new pieces I created from Denny's artwork along with some of the supplies I use. I'll try to get those done in the next week sometime. (And yes, Bob_R, I can't imagine using a camera with film after having this one for last couple years. )
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-20-2004, 06:49 AM
Sprocket Joined: 10-22-2003, 08:57 AM Posts: 13
Okay. I had some time last night to take some more pictures of what I used to put this together and the new pieces I made for the set. The Ofoto link in the first post will get you there; the new photos I've added to the end of the original album.
My Supplies - I bought the cutting board, rulers, leather finger protector, exacto knife, rubber cement, hard rubber roller & adhesive tape at the Hobby Lobby here in town. The Lamp you see in the upper right is a "daylight" lamp I bought on sale at Dick Blick just before Xmas. The latter I found extremely useful for all the fine cuts as it provides excellent light right where you need it trying to line up the ruler correctly. I just realized I forgot add my "glueing sheet" to the picture setup. It's just a poster size sheet of some foggy plastic that was in the same section as the cutting board supplies.
9) Rubber Cement & Adhesive - I read a lot of stuff on these boards before going out and buying my own supplies. I did buy some of the Elmer's Craft Glue (kind of a light blue) and used that on my first couple tunnels. Unfortunately, I must have kept putting too much glue on as the walls would always warp as they dried. I made several attempts with less and less glue but didn't ever get satisfying results.
My wife is very "crafty" and actually recommended the Rubber Cement. I tried it and now it's all I use. You can put practically a whole jar and it never soaks into the cardstock and therefore never warps. I did find that I had to be fairly quick about it with the larger pieces (Chamber Walls & Doors especially) as it starts to dry pretty fast, but after just a few pieces I felt like a pro. Slap some down with the brush, push it around to cover everything on one side of the fold-over, then press it flat and use the hard rubber roller to get rid of the excess cement. You *do* have to be careful with the excess cement that gets on the roller; not because it's hard to remove, but because the excess is still freshly wet. If you use that part of the roller on your printed piece the ink will get smeared in that area. Clean up is also a breeze, just let it dry on the roller and your glueing surface for as little as a few minutes, then rub the surface briskly with your fingertips. In very little time all the cement has been turned into those "glue boogers" we all played with as kids at craft time in elementary school (or was that just me? ;D).
The Roll-On Adhesive I bought on a whim. This stuff is excellent for applying glue to the tabs! Just lay the tab flat, zip the adhesive over it, then press the tab into place and apply firm pressure for about 10 seconds. VERY easy!
I don't know what I would've done without it. Applying rubber cement to the tabs just didn't work, and so I went back to Hobby Lobby looking for something else. I did try some blue glue pens they had but didn't find them very useful. Then I stumbled across these (I think in the scrapbooking section of the store IIRC), tried them out and found them to work wonderfully. However, this glue will *NOT* come off my glue sheet like the rubber cement does. It's permanent stuff. For that reason (along with the fact that it was Xmas time and we had tons of mail-order catalogs laying around everywhere) I started using a disposable surface to apply the glue strip to the tabs. By carefully laying out each piece so as not to get stuck to the catalog page from previous applications of the adhesive I was able to use each page in the catalog for about a dozen or so pieces. Then, when the page was full of left over adhesive spots I'd turn the page in the catalog, press it firmly to make the adhesive stick, and use the next page as my new adhesive surface. It worked very well (except for one catalog that my wife actually wanted, oops).
I didn't remember to add it to the picture, but I also used some 3M removable double-sided tape they had in the scrapbooking section (this is different than the post-it tape I was discussing in an earlier post). It's supposed to be used for pictures and stuff but it worked great for temporarily sticking together a number of risers, stairs, etc. When I separated the pieces last night and removed the double-sided tape I didn't have a single tear, and that was after it having been there a month or more.
10) Here's a shot of all the new pieces I made with a DTP program by copying & pasting various parts of Denny's .pdfs to make some specialized pieces I wanted to have.
11) After having purchased the tabbed walls in Gothic Realms, I really wanted to have them for CaveWorks. So my first step was taking Denny's Floating Walls and making different walls of various lengths (1 square up to 7 squares) and giving each of them tabs. This picture shows the results for 1, 2, 3, 4 and 6 square walls.
In the upper mid-left of the photo you can also see the single stair I made from the 3-step stairs included in Cave Works. Not only did I use this as stairs up to the low riser, but also as a platform for the trapped dwarf statue in Area #13.
[Here ends Part #1, because the Messageboard won't let me post such a long message. Thank you. ]
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-20-2004, 06:50 AM
Sprocket Joined: 10-22-2003, 08:57 AM Posts: 13
[Here is Part #2 of the too long message. Thank you. ]
12) Here's a picture of the tabbed Chamber Walls. I included these two to remind me to make a special point. Look at the difference in print quality between the two otherwise identical pieces. See how the front one is so much vibrant and richer of the two?
For most of this set I was making sure to select the Heavyweight Paper type in the Printing Dialog. The results, unfortunately, are the drab, washed out version in back. I thought the copying & pasting in the DTP program was somehow losing alot of the great color & detail that Denny's PDFs are so full of.
It turns out that *I* was causing it by selecting the Heavyweight paper type before printing. The front piece I got by forgetting to select the Heavyweight paper so it printed out to its default "normal paper". I made this mistake pretty much at the end of all my printing for this layout, so it's something I'll be sure to remember not to screw with for my next attempt.
BTW, I have a HP DeskJet 952C for those that don't want to make the same mistake.
In the top center of the image you can see a Short Tunnel with a Blank Door over it. I made those to simulate some dead-ends here and there, printing I think 6 to sheet like the Doors come.
Finally, you get a fairly good look at the stairs going up to the high riser. That's the original 3-step stairs I think. I just used some of that double-sided tape to keep them firmly inside the "Stair Tunnel" I made that's better viewed in Picture 14.
13) The tabbed Chamber Door is up front, with the Portcullis/Jail Door I made in the top middle. Yes, that piece takes a fair amount of careful trimming to keep from tearing through the thin connecting piece along the bottom of the bars that holds them together.
To the upper left you can see the single stair in the Stair Tunnel I made to get to the low risers. Better view in the next/last picture.
14) The Stair Tunnels on the left and right I created by taking some of the Chamber Wall (go back to Picture #12 and compare, it's the left side), attaching it to a floor and giving it tabs at ground-level at the bottom and riser-level at the top. The high riser Stair Tunnel has a 2x3 floor, so it easily accomodated the stairs included in the set. The low riser Stair Tunnel only needed a single stair, but to keep the "rising wall" effect I needed to use a 2x2 floor for the piece.
In the center of the image is the tabbed Corridor Corner I created. The Curved Tunnel in the set was great in many places, but a few needed a 90-degree 2x2 corner so voila!
On top of the high risers you can see a 2x2 Dead-end with tabs. I actually ended up making these with flat top walls to accomodate the Door flaps, as well as wavy/rolling topped walls. (If you read between the lines there you'll realize I made the wavy/rolling topped version first, then realized I need to put a Door flap there and went back and made the flat-topped version. )
Last but not least, on top of the low riser you see the first piece I think I created, a simple 2x2 Tunnel. While I could've just used a couple 2-square Floating walls, they don't come with a floor and they just aren't as sturdy.
Hope all this helps someone. I know I've learned a lot in the process of building this. I'm looking forward to doing the Dwarven Level the Forge of Fury with the Gothic Realms set next. That'll be a couple months away (as my group only plays once per month), but I'll try and get some pictures up here when it's all done.
A better and easier way to use rubber cement is to coat both pieces to be joined and let the cement dry. They align and press them together and you have a very solid bond without the messy wetness. You can take your time too because you let the cement dry on both pieces.
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-20-2004, 10:21 AM
Sprocket Joined: 10-22-2003, 08:57 AM Posts: 13
My wife pointed that out to me after I started using the stuff. What I noticed doing it that way was the bond was good, but not as permanent. That is, with a bit of effort I could pull the two pieces apart. My wife does it all the time when she wants to be able to reposition something for her crafts.
I've thought about doing it to the bottoms of tunnels and premade rooms and things, to give them some sticking power when I set them out on the battlemat, similar to what Denny describes with the low heat glue gun in the Beginner's Guide. I haven't tried it yet, and I'm unsure whether doing so would mar or rip the Masterboard floor when it came time to lift the tunnel off.
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-20-2004, 03:21 PM
Dirigible Joined: 01-19-2004, 08:00 AM Posts: 1672 Location: White Rock,BC,Canada
Wow ! I love what you've done with your mods of caveworks. Your giving me some great ideas for future mods using my own techniques. I'm already going to have to alter my system when I pick up caveworks myself. Unfortuneatly :-/, caves look better with curved walls so my system won't work as well, and may require extreme rethinking. Thanks for all the inst. and tips as well as the pics, they will be very useful. Keep it up, and add more pics as you go (trust me , I plan to). Looking forward to more.
"Sir...I think you have a problem with your brain being missing" Zoe ~ Firefly
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-20-2004, 03:23 PM
WorldWorks Developer Joined: 05-27-2002, 05:55 AM Posts: 10213 Location: Vancouver Island, Canada
I've got a new masterboard technique that kicks some serious butt over previous methods. With this new method you can place your models and literally flip the board upside down without anything moving. This one change eliminates the biggest problem/criticism with cardstock models........Wish I could say more but the tutorial coincides with a soon to be released product. Just wanted to let you know it’s coming, sorry to be a tease.
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 02-25-2004, 12:34 AM
COG Joined: 01-30-2004, 01:39 PM Posts: 91
What Denny ISN'T saying is that the secret is copious amounts of spray glue on everything. Spray the board, your models, your minis, your friends your dice, your dog....
Works great. Especially in cramped gaming environments with the fumes and all. This also explains why things seem to be going so slowly. Denny's passed out from fumes half the time! ;D
Huh! Somehow I missed this thread a couple of weeks ago.
Dang, DrSpunj, those mods look sharp! How much of the work is done on the DTP, and how much was good old fashioned cut 'n' paste? I'd love to tweak some of my stuff in a like manner, but don't have any software to help with the process.
D
"You feel that eating the little dog was a bad idea."
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 03-09-2004, 11:35 AM
Sprocket Joined: 10-22-2003, 08:57 AM Posts: 13
Thanks! ;D (Glad the picture link is still working, too!)
I'm afraid all of it was done with the DTP program. Once I'd made the first few pieces and they came out okay I got a lot bolder messing around with other pieces. After seeing what Denny had done with the other pieces for CaveWorks & VillageWorks I was able to "preconnect" a lot of the floors and walls and save myself a bit of tabbing & gluing here & there, so there was actually a little less "cut 'n' paste" when I was done than there might have been.
For instance, the 2x2 Tunnels were a single piece that fit on a single page (8" long and 6" wide, plus the tabs around the outside). After cutting it out and folding/glueing the wall over, I just had to score the corners and the single floor fold, trim the doorways, glue the tab at the end of the 4th wall to the 1st wall, then finally glue the 3 remaining "floor tabs" to the floor. The 2x2 Deadends and Corner worked similarly. I was very happy as I got the hang of things how slick everything came together!
Still, since everything I did was just "electronic" cut 'n paste using Denny's .pdfs, I'm pretty sure you could do things with actual cutting & pasting and get similar results.
Post subject: Re: Forge of Fury - Mountain Door Pictures
Posted: 04-16-2004, 10:31 AM
COG Joined: 03-15-2004, 12:16 PM Posts: 120
Awesome work DrSpunj.
I have put a copy of all these pictures on the Image Gallery on my site. You can get a link to it in my signature. If you want, I can assign your name to the pictures, but you have to signup for an account. You cna then let me know.
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