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| Convince me that the Carrier is ever worth the points http://www.worldworksgames.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=6203 |
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| Author: | Highland_Piper [ 06-15-2008, 10:26 PM ] |
| Post subject: | Convince me that the Carrier is ever worth the points |
I played two games as the Separatist Sample Army this weekend. Although the first game was just one big fumble the second game really showed me how to use the Control Corvettes, the Missile Ships and the Awesome Skirmish Fighters.... ....but the Carrier is a big lumbering waist of points. No armor, 2 dmg only, the +1 for mission briefing really is a waste of time, in the game that is a quick skirmish there really is no time to disengage injured ships to dock, wait to repair then leave. Wasting the minimum of 3 turns but probably more if you add the time for the ships to get to the carrier in the first place. The Auto fire is alright. I would rather take four more fighters then the carrier any time. Which is a real shame as it is a cool looking ship. So Beta Testers, tell me why this lumbering piece of scrap metal which is the Convoy Carrier is worth 40 pts (or 35 if you look on the other side of the Stat Card) Harsh? Maybe, but I fail to see any advantage to this unit. |
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| Author: | scotherns [ 06-16-2008, 03:39 AM ] |
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My first (only) game so far had pretty much the same conclusion - but I was going to wait for a bit more experience before writing it off! Maybe if your fighters could start launched AND have their orders given right from the start if you had a carrier present, then that would make them worth having? I'm still going to try using it for a few more games to see if it has hidden depths 
Steve |
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| Author: | GAWD [ 06-16-2008, 05:22 AM ] |
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| Author: | TeknoMerk [ 06-16-2008, 05:42 AM ] |
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| Author: | GAWD [ 06-16-2008, 05:56 AM ] |
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| Author: | Highland_Piper [ 06-16-2008, 06:31 AM ] |
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| Author: | GAWD [ 06-16-2008, 08:22 AM ] |
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| Author: | Highland_Piper [ 06-16-2008, 09:28 AM ] |
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Ok how can you say the fighters in "the fighters on board the carrier move the same amount in two turns as the fighters in the open" The Carrier only gets one Move where fighters get two moves each turn. It does not matter so after two turns the fighter have moved 24" and the Carrier has moved only 12". Unless there is a rule I'm missing in which case can you site the page as there is no index. |
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| Author: | GAWD [ 06-16-2008, 10:00 AM ] |
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| Author: | Bedwyr [ 06-16-2008, 10:07 AM ] |
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What about nerfing the fighters (and by the sounds of "muahaha" in the background it sounds like they need nerfing) by limiting range and forcing a re-dock with the carrier to re-fuel? |
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| Author: | Highland_Piper [ 06-16-2008, 10:42 AM ] |
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Ok I see where your coming from, but that still leaves the fighters at the exact same spot (less if its missile fighters using afterburners). Whats the advantage? Safe transport? Nothing can really hit anything else in the first two rounds, and with a DEF +6 it is not the ideal place to store your fighters from attack. So I still need convincing that the Carrier is worth the points. Maybe if it had a longer range than the Particlebow (Uncharged) I would say it was worth it, but I fail to see how it acts as a support vessel. The Repair crews on deck! is not worth it unless the fighter is Reduced and then good luck trying to move it to the Carrier. You don't want to leave your fighters next to the carrier all the time because that defeats the purpose of it. |
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| Author: | Sacretis [ 06-16-2008, 10:49 AM ] |
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Ok Highland Piper, just to clarify; are you playing with the error on the fighter cards that limits their movement when they are damaged? Just making sure that you realize that that was a copy and paste error on Denny's part. If it's not playing out to be balanced, I suggest you experiment with house rules until the beta team can fix it with errata. Maybe have the fighters be progressively harder to hit as they become damaged? That was suggested in another thread and it might help to increase the survivability of damaged fighter squads... Sacretis |
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| Author: | Bedwyr [ 06-16-2008, 10:51 AM ] |
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I was just thinking forcing a re-dock in 3-5 full turns or the fighters drift. |
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| Author: | GAWD [ 06-16-2008, 11:25 AM ] |
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| Author: | Highland_Piper [ 06-16-2008, 01:01 PM ] |
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| Author: | GAWD [ 06-16-2008, 01:10 PM ] |
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| Author: | taraba [ 06-16-2008, 02:02 PM ] |
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| Author: | Bedwyr [ 06-16-2008, 03:50 PM ] |
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| Author: | mcclaud [ 06-17-2008, 09:37 PM ] |
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| Author: | Tyler Tinsley [ 06-17-2008, 09:47 PM ] |
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| Author: | Highland_Piper [ 06-18-2008, 12:17 AM ] |
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| Author: | mcclaud [ 06-18-2008, 01:41 AM ] |
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Aaaah, now I see what you are saying. Yeah, I'm not sure the cards are adequately covering the rules for fighter repairs. Some of our problems are related to the ship cards lately, methinks. If I had to do this logically (and I'm getting clarification) depending on the INIT bands of action: If you dock your fighters (fighters' actions) and then activate the carrier action, you fix your fighters in the same turn (you don't have to wait an entire turn). And then during the next round, you can move them away. OR If you initiate the repair action (Carrier's action), then move/launch fighters (fighters' action), you can do that in one turn. It's entirely dependent on how you read it. In my case, I have been playing since the fighter docking/launching is a separate action from the carrier repair action, then you can do one action per ship in the same turn. I'd also have to go look, but if fighters can take TWO move actions, you may be able to get them in and out of the carrier. I don't have any of my stuff before me, but it seems logical that the fighters don't have to spend three or even two whole turns in the carrier unless you need to build them up from being almost gone to full strength. Once a fighter squadron gets nicked, I take it back and swap out another stand full. The nicked squad flips in, repairs to the next level, flips out and runs back. I have played an entire battle not losing one fighter squadron this way (so to me, the carrier has been pretty essential - especially when the mission briefings to my bomber squads caused the victorious destruction of two particle bows in play). I am going to write up a house rule, though, that limits fighters based on a carrier presense. If you don't have a carrier in your Fleet, you cannot have more than four fighter stands in play at any one time. So bye bye 6 to 8 fighter fleets with no carrier. When I think about stacking, my thoughts are this: If you activate one ability on a ship, you can't stack similar abilities on ships. That is, you can't target two Control Cruiser abilities (like Scramble) or two mission briefings on one squadron on one ship. However, you can activate two abilities of different natures - a mission briefing and a Scramble, for example - on one ship. I'd also say that you could stack two mission briefings on one ship if they belong to two separate fighter groups. And maybe this isn't clear and needs to be cleared up better. I'll concede that my interpretation of the rules is probably more loose than someone who reads deep into every rule. And perhaps that's my failing with the rulesbook. |
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| Author: | Highland_Piper [ 06-18-2008, 02:40 AM ] |
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| Author: | Andorax [ 06-18-2008, 04:56 AM ] |
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Clarifications being posted now. |
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| Author: | GAWD [ 06-18-2008, 05:29 AM ] |
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| Author: | FNH [ 06-21-2008, 01:36 PM ] |
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