Looks like the clock is winding down for D20 - Goodman Games has put the Dungeon Crawl Classics on sale as PDFs for $2 US each on RPGNow/DTRPG. When the sale ends they will be removed from the site.

One exception is the big boxed set Castle Whiterock, which runs at $5.

I picked up a few, including Whiterock - I can mine them for ideas if nothing else.

The Auld Grump

Gone for good! That is a shame! Looks like they are $3.00 - $10.00 on e23

That's a real shame. We ran through one of the Goodman Games scenarios a year a go just for a change from the regular campaign and also because a few of us agreed with the preamble on the front of most of his books. The bit about hack and slay and remember when NPC's could be killed. We ran it as a nostalgia trip and enjoyed it so much we got a few more and stitched them together into a very enjoyable years campaign.

We still enjoy a more narrative driven campaign and occasionally end up roleplaying the whole session with the dice hardly leaving the bag but there is definitely a place for the old-school way as well.

Off to RPG to see what I fancy, thanks for the tip-off.

Apologies for the double post but I forgot something,

As Goodman Games stuff is PDF and therefore only exists on hard drives why is he stopping selling them? Do RPG charge a fortune for hosting? What I'm trying to say is, with no tangible producut to require a reprint he could keep them up indefinitely. Or until the hosting costs outweigh the income generated.

I have wondered this myself, as Goodman Games is not the first to do this. Maybe there is a annual fee that is need for RPGNow (Onebook whatever) and it's this that maybe outweighing the profits.


Shame



Lord Abaddon of Wormwood

I don't think its because of Onebookshelf. It's has to do with WotC GSL (4e) license. You can not sell both 3e and 4e at the same time. If you jump on the 4e bandwagon you must stop selling 3e stuff (or have it converted to 4e). If you go with 4e you're commited to 4e no going back.

There is also a deadline on removing 3e stuff if you go 4e, and as Auld has said those that aren't switching must sanitize their product of the 20d logo and stuff (into OGL).

I think WotC pulled the 20d license already but are giving companies until end of the year to comply (this part I'm not sure). So thats why you will see companies doing sales like this before the year is up.

Thanks, AG. I picked up several of them, including Whiterock Castle and Gazeteer of the Realms. These look great. I'm planning to use Gazeteer to base a campaign on. Great tip. I'll probably revisit rpgnow right before the 31st to snag a few more.

Luckyjoe

It's this type of practice that has made me desert wotc/hasbro whatever they're called this week. I'm not turning this thread into the old 3e vs 4e debate but if they were confident that 4e would sell then they wouldn't have to resort to tactics that make people like me think they know their new product is a pile of cr@p and have to do all they can to shut down the competition. (ironically their own system)

Thanks again for the tip Grump, I'm now about $50 lighter in the wallet and have enough stuff to combine with my own writing and last me a decade.

It would probably be easy enough for Goodman games to have a spin off company dealing with 3rd ed if they wanted to but that's probably more hassle than it's worth. I'd be tempted if I was in that business though just to hose off wizards.

I can understand why WotC is doing this - they are trying to avoid splitting their market. If folks are buying 3.X material, and WotC is no longer making 3.X material then all those sales are ones that did not go to WotC - so no one can make 3.e. Unfortunately (for WotC - not the rest of the world) the OGL was written in such a way that it cannot be rescinded (though the D20 license can - which is why that is what WotC is coming down on right now).

However, they can put a clause in the 4e GSL that you cannot create 4e material if you are producing products in the same line for other games (which is a good thing for WotC - not the rest of the world). And this is what they have done.

It is however not going unchallenged - Kingdoms of Kalamar from Kenzer & Co has a 4e PDF as well as their older materials (except the ones that actually had the D&D logo, more on that in a bit ). This may seem risky, but... something to bear in mind is that Mr. Kenzer's day job is Intellectual Properties lawyer - and WotC losing the last time they tangled was how Kenzer & Co gained the right to use the D&D logo in the first place....

I am not a huge fan of the Kalamar setting (for the same reasons I am not a huge fan of Forgotten Realms and Greyhawk), but I wish Mr. Kenzer the very best of luck in this.

The Auld Grump

Grump, do you have a list of Goodman PDF's that you would recommend? I want to pick some up, but don't feel like paying for dross to get gold.

-Steve

So, you end up getting anything?

The DCC series is indeed gone.

The Auld Grump

Anyone mess with their 4e products yet?

To add to what Grump said:

Mearls is also the type of person who - when pushing his own creations around - always tears down the old lore/ideas/game. Hasbro said it doesn't have anything to do with splitting the audience between two systems, and Mike Mearls said that it was because 3.x is a bad system, and 4e is there to replace it full-time. And WotC was fully behind that decision.

Right now, the GSL is back under review by Hasbro themselves, because WotC has pretty much torn away 70% of the independent market through the stipulation that you can't make 3.x products if you are producing 4e stuff. They are pulling D&D's reigns away from Mearls and handing them over to Andy (whose last name I cannot remember right now) to revise the GSL so that companies like Paizo, Green Ronin, etc. are no longer in direct competition with them using their own OGL materials.